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Forum: Theological Expressions
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We need changed hearts, not miracles. (Wahshing)
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Why many kept calling myJesus,a false healer,today?
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It's time to come back from "Experience" to Scriptures! (Christopher Yip)
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All those queries and distortions were refuted long ago!Here's more.
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"Refuted"? You mean "rancour", don't you? (Christopher Yip)
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I oblige You. (FrankieLee)
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And I am STILL waiting ... (Christopher Yip)
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Please be open and I assume you are reasonable.1. (FrankieLee)
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Let us exercise Sound reasonings. (FrankieLee)
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Betol Lah!!! Very good insight! (SK)
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Be warned...!!!! (John Doe 666)
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Are you're suggesting all the past healings crusades are of the Devil? n/t (SA)
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some insights (John Doe 666)
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Let's reason out properly with the help of the Holy Spirit. (SA)
Date: 2001, Sep 05
From: John Doe 666 John666

YOU: Please don't jump to conclusion just like that. If you can't understand the past revivals enough to forgo outdated doctrines, at least ask the Lord to show you the truth about all those names whom you think is working in collaboration with satan please. (May God help us all here!)
John666:
Did I say in 'collaboration' with Satan??? Collaoration requires agreement between 2 parties. What I am saying is that EVEN though Satan works his Evil stuff, GOD will turn it around and work through it. ( Like in Jobs case and many others, and the reason is God's promises in Romans 8:28 )
Please don't get emotional and panic. read and try to understand first.
YOU: Yes this I agree. We don't follow a person (or a revival ministry ) who is in leadership of the ministry, unless that person is following the Lord in the first place. Do revival seekers have to be always so blinded or so dumb as to be tricked by Satan's ploy? Can they not be 'sick of the status quo' in church and are looking for the reality of what's is really of God as is shown us in the Holy Word of God, and not just past historical church movements or doctrines only? Can remaining in stagnant relationship in our walk with the Lord and in spiritual ministry in the missions fields be not of the devil's ploy too?
John666:
Do you know for sure when one person is following the Lord fully ? Don't decieve yourself. If we knew that, there would be no cults today or any deviations today. So whats the point: We don't know for sure, except we see the fruit, but even the fruit we see are contitioned by our past and personality. You imply that revival seekers are not so dumb to be tricked by Satan's ploy ? My friend, do you know that anyone can be tricked by Satan ?doesn't matter if he/she is a great person of God or not. Once we are not led by the Spirit , we will fall. If they are sick of the status quo, can they do anyhing they wish? Does being stagnant in the church not better than letting the evil one decieve many? And, how do you measure being stagnant anyway ? No growth in numbers ?? In that case, It is not being stagnant in GOD's EYES. How do we know if God is not refining the Church without growth in numbers..??? The crux of the matter is if we wait and follow His Word and leading of The Spirit of God in the way HE wants us to go and not to panic and do our own thing in ATTEMPTING to bring revival........ Man cannot bring about a revival without God initiating and achiving it.
YOU: The apostasy has started way back in the dead church of yesteryears. How many reformations and revivals have since taken place from Luther's time? Of course the church is not perfect and God is judging His church before His return. That's why a lot of ministries are going through the fire right now. Those who fail to see what is of God will miss the real revival and be part of the apostate church. Those who do not trust God enough to purge His own church also will miss it if they attribute to the devil what is of God.
John666: Yes Apostasy started way back. But not the kind of Apostasy that we are going to see in the end times. You say that those who fail to see what is of God will miss the real revival. I don't agree. When the real revival comes No one can close their eyes, because it will be right before thier eyes. Everyone will know. When the true revival comes, there will be NO questions asked. It will be impossible for anyone to even ask a question.
You also seem to indicate that EVERYTHING that happens in a church, by default is of GOD ......I think that is very deceptive. Do you mean to say that all that is going in a church today is of God just because we pray it to be so? Far from it. I think you should think about it a bit more.
YOU: Have you been to the healing meetings in the first place? Have you been baptised in the Holy Spirit yourself? Are you able to discern what is of the Holy Spirit and what is of the Devil? The reason why i ask all these questions to you is not to make you angry but it is the beginning of how then the doctrine of Divine Healing and the Gifts of the Holy Spirit can be fully discussed. You may say, i'm avoiding the issue. My reply is what is of the Holy Spirit cannot be pinpointed down in just words and description. Whether one attribute the healing to God depends on WHO the person is asking the healing from. How can we say that the devil heal the person when we who are christians have prayed, fasted or interceded??? If the person get worse we can easily say its the will of God. Why then the contradiction? When healing takes place we say it is of the Devil?
John666: I know I have the Holy Spirit in me. It is an assurance I have that no man nor any created thing can take away. Just because Christians have prayed, do you mean to say that Satan cannot work ? What about Job's case.? Didn't He pray to God ? He did. But until the sickness caused by Satan was removed by God, Job suffered. Do you mean to say just because Christians fasted and prayed for a sick person God has to heal ? No He doesn't have to. He can. He doesn't HAVE TO. I don't see the contradiction.
How can you say that everyone who finds relief/healing has had it from God. Does God heal everyone ?
-John666