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We cannot really say they do nothing for only God knows their hearts, and that is more important 
We are NOT sinners (Keith)
SAINTS OR SINNERS? (Ivan)
We still sin but we are not call sinner (True Light)
SAINTS OR "AINTS" (Ivan)
just for your info... (Royston Ong)
Royston, please do not put words in my posting:" I say it is natural to be AWARE I am a sinner" eom. (Ivan)
In God's eyes, (Royston Ong)
Hey Royston, (Interested )
Thanks for your affirmation, Interested. (Royston Ong)
Hi Royston, (Interested )
On Modern Christianity (Royston Ong)
Modern Christianity? (True Light)
On Methodism's Sunday Christians... (Royston Ong)
Are we talking about sinner or Christian? (True Light)
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***Are we in the same channel? In the above illustrations, are you referring to sinners? If it is, I would agree with you. As for me, all the while I am comparing Christians that works with Christians who sit there doing nothing. In order to have a clear understanding, we have to define "works". A previous forumer called Vessel of Mercy did give a good explanation on "works". Hi TL, As mentioned in another thread with you. 1 Cor 3:12-15 is clear for those who profess to be Christians but had what they considered as all their works burnt to smitherins, but yet they are still accorded the same righteousness as you and I. On the earlier thread issue, the sinner would cease to exist as a sinner, once he acknowledges Christ is Lord and Saviour. Instead, he is a saint, without having to justify himself on the basis of works. But nevertheless, that question and answer I had posed in the earlier thread, is purely referring from a sinners standpoint. And you are correct to read me there. Thanks also for your agreeing with me on that count. As for comparisons between the Christians with works and the Christians who sits there doing nothing. It is clear that James was chiding those who are giving empty remarks like:("the Lord will bless you indeed" instead of doing the needful thing, that is to clothe the brother if he needed clothes), to do what is necessarily a better option, is the more desired expression of faith. But James was not saying that a saint is ONLY recognised by his works. That time, the church was not displaying the love of God to its community, like the case of Acts 2:42, where they sold their properties and shared everything. The fundamental recognition of a saint is a person who recognises Christ as Lord and Saviour. Simple as that, no one should add upon that and then burden our brothers to earn their salvation through works, when their salvation has already been assured. Instead, it should be, because your salvation is assured, what then would be your response? The natural thing should be what happens in, again, Acts 2:42. Therefore, what is clear in the Bible is a Christian with works, would be given more when in heaven, while a Christian without works, would be chided, but not kicked out of the family of God. (cf Luke 12:37-48 gives harshness to those who are Christians...notice v47 and v48, those who know and those who do not know. They were punished but not cast out. However, only those who act wilfully against God's will, are thrown away and given a place with the unbelievers) ALternatively, let us view the Christian with no works. How would we be able to know he has no works? By whether he has a transformed life? Maybe that is one approach, but still this can be faked. So it all boils down to the heart of each man. Only God will be able to tell. On the surface, seeing someone seemingly lacklustred does not mean that he is not growing in Christ. Seeing someone saying to you that God bless you richly,also does not mean that he is growing in Christ. Therefore, let us leave this to God, whether or not this Christian is truly with or without works. All we can do is to disciple them and walk by them, guiding them towards a Spirit-filled life with Christ and to be rooted in Christ. Hope this helps. My dear brother TL, I come more from the pastoring heart, and cannot bear to see that God will throw away Christians who are not in the know of God's will and those who know but do not act on it properly or wisely. One thing I am clear, is that those who know God's will, but choose to violate it by going their own sinful way is clearly going to eternal damnation, as did Judas Iscariot, for he was privileged to see Christ perform miracles and even know that Christ was the Messiah, yet he acted and chose to do what was not of God's will, by betraying Christ and disengaging all ties with Christ. God bless you, TL royston |
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Made a typo... by Royston Ong, 2001, Oct 23
Who is "those" by True Light, 2001, Oct 23
Yes, we are getting closer to understanding each other, probably like 3/5 there. Ü by Royston Ong, 2001, Oct 23
We are closer now, 4/5 by True Light, 2001, Oct 23
On topic of discussion in future by Royston Ong, 2001, Oct 25
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