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The reason for this discussion 
Getting into the "Secrets of the Vine" (Ivan)
Salvation & works
Thanks LBS, do you want to contribute and form your own conclusion,if any? eom. (Ivan)
Responding
Hi Truelight, Do me a favour first
Recap 
Please reconsider (Ivan)
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Hi Ivan, Ivan: “I do not wish to wander around in circle… The question before us is this: Is the person truly born-again?” LBS: Agree with you that it is absolutely important to focus on the issue of salvation. In fact, I have more than once stressed that that is the reason why I am engaged in this discussion. You said we need to ask: Is a person saved? I will ask: What must a person do/believe to be saved? Unfortunately, I think based on the feedback in this thread, I believe that there is at least one person who believes in the following gospel message: No eternal security, your good works count towards your salvation. Gospel message? Believe Christ died for your sins, you believe that, good, you are saved, but remember to bear fruits/do good works or else you will not be saved. I am not saying that you believe/preach the above gospel message. The reason why I keep going to Rom 1-5 is to show that the gospel message there is a person needs to believe that Christ died for his/her sins and trust in that alone in order to obtain eternal life, works has no place at all in God’s plan of salvation for us today. At the point of belief, God saves the sinner and it is God’s faithfulness that will guarantee his/her eternal salvation. The Holy Spirit enters into a believer at the point of belief and sealed him/her so that he/she will definitely take the place of his/her inheritance in the heavenly places in the ages to come (Eph 1:13,14, Eph 2: 1-9). God tells us in Gal 1:9 that there is only one gospel we should preach today. So that’s why I think it is absolutely important that we all agree what that one gospel is. Agree? |
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Messages
Outline:
Hi LBS by Ivan, 2001, Nov 11
Amen! Ivan, I think you explained better. by True Light, 2001, Nov 11 
You forgot the FMs & the Readers. Hehehe! eom by saved-by-grace, 2001, Nov 12
Oops! Errr! the FM & readers are represented by those dots. kekeke! EOM by True Light, 2001, Nov 12
Closing the gap in our understanding? by LBS, 2001, Nov 11
O gosh! The debate is going to repeat itself one more time? by saved-by-grace, 2001, Nov 12
For your sake who is still on the milk of God's word and not ready for solid food, by Ivan, 2001, Nov 12
Wrapping up by LBS, 2001, Nov 17
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